How Much Time Have I Wasted Waiting for Xojo?

Many Xojo developers use a number of plugins because they do things that Xojo doesn’t or can’t do out of the box.  My current plugin folder has 49 items and at times in my 20+ years as a Xojo developer I’ve had closer to 60 loaded.  This begs the question how much freaking time have I waited on Xojo to load and then compile plugins?  Depending on how many different projects (and thus plugin sets I have) I work on I’d bet this results in over an hour per month.

Loading large projects is slow.  Some of the larger projects I work on take minutes to load.  That’s long enough to go grab a refreshment from the kitchen and get back to my desk before it finishes loading.  And that’s for desktop projects.  The last time I used Web (granted API 1.0) our large projects took even longer. I don’t have any Web 2.0 or iOS projects to compare the loading times.

Saving projects has definitely improved in the last couple of releases but in our largest projects it’s still slow.  And don’t get me going on all the time I (and our team) spend on getting rid of property changes in git commits. These stupid property changes has got to stop because it’s pissing us all off. Same with changes with shared external code between desktop and console applications. It simply sucks and we’re tired of it.

All in all I feel like Xojo is wasting a significant part of my day just waiting for things to happen or fixing things so git isn’t overwhelmed.  Coming up with faster ways for all those things should be priority number one because it affects everyone.  I dunno about the challenges to doing this but I feel like Xojo could be doing more. You’d think with the IDE being a very large project they’d feel the pain also of many of my pain points.

Really, all I want at the end of the day is to feel like Xojo isn’t wasting my time.

14 thoughts on “How Much Time Have I Wasted Waiting for Xojo?

  1. Sadly those possible future improvements wont be applied to web 1 projects.

    We, at our little company spend over 4 hours in busy months, just waiting for the IDE. Apart from loading a project, the waiting time for a debug run can be over 8 minutes sometime.

    We then do other things in the meantime, like writing documentations and stuff. Buts not good to jump between tasks in that way.

    I really wish the IDE were faster.

  2. I’ve spent most of the last 40 years supporting clients and their applications. One thing I’ve learnt is that you can be committed to a product to the point of bending it to breaking point. I’m not talking about just development tools here, but line of business applications – so many failures due to work arounds!

    I’ve been using Xojo/Realbasic since about 2004, and while I have no exception to third party plugins I have yet to find a necessity to use them.

    So Xojo is fast to load and delivers my needs (which are perhaps simple?), but yes there are bugs I’d love to see fixed.

  3. We begged for about 20 years for faster speeds there. I would love to have all Xojo staff install Einhugur and MBS Plugins to feel the pain in daily work.

    Xojo loads plugins at start to extract declarations.
    On this way it creates a rbxcache file. I asked to compare file dates, keep the rbxcache file and reuse it to be faster on next run.

    Then pre-compilation runs slowly. We asked for this to run in preemptive-threads (it’s C++ code mostly) or to move this into a worker for newer versions.

    And all the wrapper code generation for plugins could be smaller in general and skip a lot of operations. See this feedback case where we check what it does and skip it.

    Please support the cases.

  4. An hour a month!? (puts on Yorkshire accent) Luxury.

    My project (quite big) takes c. 5 minutes to load. If the plugins need reloading, that’s another 5 minutes. Per platform. Saving a single change is sometimes instantaneous, and sometimes yet another minute. Go figure.

    Most annoying is that I can no longer do the four finger salute (Cmd S cmd R) to save and run. You have to do cmd S, wait for a minute, during which time you can’t do anything else, and then Cmd R.

    It’s like wading through molasses in winter.

  5. I thought you meant “waiting for Xojo to fix bugs”? I’ve been waiting for 10+ years…

  6. I’m afraid that every C++ developer simply just envies you for only wasting an hour per month… There’s an interesting discussion between Bjarne Stroustroup, Rob Pike and others on YouTube where Rob Pike mentions a number how many –man years– Google alone wastes every year thanks to the C++ pre-compiler.

    It’s somewhere in this video:

    • Bjarne is talking about how long the *compiler* takes to do work (and the performance issues there have more to do with template instantiation than the preprocessor), which is a different ball of wax from your *editor* not being responsive.

      When the compiler takes a long time to build some large project, you can go do useful work elsewhere (or run your compilations on a server somewhere else). When the editor takes a long time, you basically have to wait and twiddle your thumbs.

      (Obviously, being slow in either place is not good, but I’ll take slow compiles over a slow editor any day.)

  7. My biggest time waster is the constant flip flopping of view properties & values thats been getting worse
    I changed 3 lines of code in what should be one file (in a class) and got 38 altered files
    Wading through all of those to check in JUST the actual chnages I made wastes more time than just about anything else in my current work day

    • yeah, gotta admit we spend a lot of time dealing with this. I changed one file and had 89 files that had the stupid property changes. And yes, it feels like it’s gotten worse the past two releases.

      • I’m finding it much worse when I move back and forth between Mac & Windows
        Edit something on the Mac, check it in, maybe touch it again on Windows & it decides to touch a pile. Clean up. Check in. Go back to my mac and make a few more changes and it decides to do a pile more changes.
        Definitely seems worse

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